Canoe ID
- Thread starter Dan R.
- Start date
That is a Robertson. The outline font on the stamps is diagnostic. Look for the "wavy" stamp on the ends of the thwarts.
There has been much discussion about this in the past. It may be the year or the width but no records are known to be available for confirmation. How wide is this canoe?
Benson
Probably, but we don't know when the sequence started, if they started with one, or how many may have been skipped along the way. The link below has more about this with other builders where some records are available. The lowest and highest known serial numbers with this font are shown below. The "A" or inverted "V" prefix is another mystery.
Benson
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Michael Grace
Lifetime Member
Hazard a guess as to the number in the middle photo above? What is known about this canoe? Has it been stripped to get a clearer look at the number? What is considered the "lowest known" number, and what is considered the "highest known"?
There were a lot of changes taking place at the Robertson factory going into the 1930s.
Charles B. Robertson (J. R. Robertson's nephew) was president; he died December 3, 1931.
J. R. Robertson returned as president. He died July 15, 1935.
Clarence Mather (formerly owner his own boatbuilding firm, and at Toppan Boat and Engine Co,) was foreman between 1934 and 1938.
Arnold Laskey assumed ownership of Robertson in 1937, and operated to at least 1955. He died in 1959.
Whether any of these changes would explain the use of this serial number style is not possible to say at this time.
Charles B. Robertson (J. R. Robertson's nephew) was president; he died December 3, 1931.
J. R. Robertson returned as president. He died July 15, 1935.
Clarence Mather (formerly owner his own boatbuilding firm, and at Toppan Boat and Engine Co,) was foreman between 1934 and 1938.
Arnold Laskey assumed ownership of Robertson in 1937, and operated to at least 1955. He died in 1959.
Whether any of these changes would explain the use of this serial number style is not possible to say at this time.
The middle image above was cleaned up to show serial number 498 35 16 as displayed at the Assembly auction in July. It was originally thought to be number 198. Chuck Cossaboom and the Norumbega chapter may have more details since they restored it.
Determining Robertson's "lowest known" and "highest known" serial numbers involves a lot of guesses since a broad variety of different fonts and formats were used. My assumption is that the length digits, width/year digits, and any leading characters can be omitted to get the base serial number. This makes the 57 in the first image from my previous message above the lowest. Similar canoes with this format include 154, 185, and 199. The lowest without a leading character is 302 as shown below.
The highest in the outline font is 3188 as shown in the previous message. An even wider range of likely Robertson serial numbers without the outline font includes a low of 81 and a high of 5998.
It seems likely that the management changes that Dan kindly listed probably had some influence on this variety of formats. The only solid documentation available is the receipt below which shows that a canoe sold in 1908 may have had serial number 1088. This canoe might not have survived since it hasn't shown up yet.
Please let me know if you have any better ideas or more information to share. Thanks,
Benson
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Michael Grace
Lifetime Member
Hi Benson. I was referring to your post above that said the "lowest and highest known serial numbers with this font are shown below." Maybe for the lowest you were referring to A57 33 16 (shown above)? The highest number I am aware of in this 3-part "outline" font is the same as you - 3188 35 16. The lowest I'm aware of in the "A" series is A21 33 16. The lowest with out the "A" that I'm aware of is 10 33 16.
This is great news. Can you share pictures of these serial numbers and any deck tags? I have been collecting images of things like this as you probably know. Thanks,
Benson
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Michael Grace
Lifetime Member
I will see what I have for these. I'm collecting this info as well, and try to keep get as much info on each one as possible.
OP
OP
Dan R.
Enthusiastic about Wooden Canoes
Interesting info!
For the case of this Robertson, the seller was not the original owner. He got it out of an old “boat club/house” 30 or 40 years ago. The “club/house” had several canoes when he got this one and an old motor boat that was used for cruises, water skiing, etc. I’ll talk with the seller more and see what other info he might have like which lake and the name of the “club/house”.
Is there something in particular that would be useful?
For the case of this Robertson, the seller was not the original owner. He got it out of an old “boat club/house” 30 or 40 years ago. The “club/house” had several canoes when he got this one and an old motor boat that was used for cruises, water skiing, etc. I’ll talk with the seller more and see what other info he might have like which lake and the name of the “club/house”.
Is there something in particular that would be useful?
The year when the club/house was founded/built might be useful to help date the canoe. Thanks,
Benson
OP
OP
Dan R.
Enthusiastic about Wooden Canoes
Hi All,
Happy to say she is safely in her new location. It may look worse than it is. The long decks are both solid and intact. The inwales are good and solid as well. She will need some stem work, cant ribs, planking, outwales and caps but not the worst one I've brought home. Maybe I'm getting better at picking them! Or just lucky. Anyway, I may have hit my limit on how many I can bring home/put in the garage. I've been put on a 1 in, 2 out plan... These craft REALLY are addicting!
This one is fun for the history. So it came from a boathouse on the Norton Reservoir next to Frate's dairy. Apparently it was quite the place in the early/mid 1900s. They even had a swan boat. A quick google online brought up a Facebook page about Norton's past and I've also found they have what appears to be an active historical society. When I get some time, I'll inquire with the historical society and see what more I can learn. Maybe they'll have some cool old photos.
Some additional pictures attached. Outside stems and 3 sets of canopy hardware. I think there is a Robertson mark on the thwart but it is hard to make out.
Happy to say she is safely in her new location. It may look worse than it is. The long decks are both solid and intact. The inwales are good and solid as well. She will need some stem work, cant ribs, planking, outwales and caps but not the worst one I've brought home. Maybe I'm getting better at picking them! Or just lucky. Anyway, I may have hit my limit on how many I can bring home/put in the garage. I've been put on a 1 in, 2 out plan... These craft REALLY are addicting!
This one is fun for the history. So it came from a boathouse on the Norton Reservoir next to Frate's dairy. Apparently it was quite the place in the early/mid 1900s. They even had a swan boat. A quick google online brought up a Facebook page about Norton's past and I've also found they have what appears to be an active historical society. When I get some time, I'll inquire with the historical society and see what more I can learn. Maybe they'll have some cool old photos.
Some additional pictures attached. Outside stems and 3 sets of canopy hardware. I think there is a Robertson mark on the thwart but it is hard to make out.
Attachments
The planking seems to be the Robertson style as shown below.
Benson
Benson
