Looking for build record and any info on S/N # 110498-16. I'm a little unsure of the first "1" digit - it wasn't clearly stamped at either bow or stern, so it's possible (although unlikely) that the actual serial # is 10498-16. The boat is in bad shape, but looks as if it can be restored. I think it's an Otca model, but the previous owner said she thought it was an "Adirondack canoe from around 1900" -- I doubt that. Thanks for your help!
Old Town 110498-16
- Thread starter DaveKunz
- Start date
Roger Young
display sample collector
Dave:
OT serial # 110498 was issued to a 16' Yankee model, CS grade, WC planking, open spruce gunnels, with oak decks, thwarts and seats. It was originally painted Deep Orange with a black stripe. and shipped on 11 July 1932 to Syracuse, NY.
However, there is a small problem in that the same # seems to have been issued to an 18' Guide model. The build records don't show a file for # 110499, so I suspect that perhaps the second card could be a misnumber, especially if the first description fits your canoe. Maybe you can let us know and a mystery can be resolved.
OT serial # 110498 was issued to a 16' Yankee model, CS grade, WC planking, open spruce gunnels, with oak decks, thwarts and seats. It was originally painted Deep Orange with a black stripe. and shipped on 11 July 1932 to Syracuse, NY.
However, there is a small problem in that the same # seems to have been issued to an 18' Guide model. The build records don't show a file for # 110499, so I suspect that perhaps the second card could be a misnumber, especially if the first description fits your canoe. Maybe you can let us know and a mystery can be resolved.
Roger Young
display sample collector
And just to be complete, if it is serial # 10498, that was issued to a 16' CR model, CS grade, WC planking, with spruce gunnels, spruce decks thwarts and seats, spruce finish rails and painted a deep or dark green, I believe. It shipped on Aug. 5 1909. to Minneapolis, MN.
Sorry, I had the wrong thumbnail attachment here; I have corrected it. Problem with working too late at night.
Sorry, I had the wrong thumbnail attachment here; I have corrected it. Problem with working too late at night.
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Thanks!
Roger:
Thanks for the fast reply - just goes to show that good canoers never sleep!
I think the canoe is likely to be your first option -- the Yankee built in 1932. I won't have the canoe here where I can examine it carefully until later this week, but I spotted no traces of the old canvas on it, so don't know about the color issue. And I don't know how the Yankee differed from the Guide or the Otca -- perhaps you could tell me where to find descriptions. The only OT catalog I have dates from 1969. Just finished restoring a 1969 Otca, and this new one seems a bit less beamy and somewhat shallower.
The question about the serial number is that the first "1" digit almost looked as if it was made by the edge of the stamp, rather than an actual digit. But the light was bad and I had to scrape away a lot of dirt even to find the number, so I'll have to take a closer look when I get it into my back yard. The fact that the 1909 boat shipped to Minnesota suggests it would be unlikely to turn up here in Rochester.
BTW, you sent the build record for 110498 twice, once in each post. If you have the one for 10498, I'd appreciate receiving it too.
Thanks a lot for your help. I'll get back to you when I know a little more!
Roger:
Thanks for the fast reply - just goes to show that good canoers never sleep!
I think the canoe is likely to be your first option -- the Yankee built in 1932. I won't have the canoe here where I can examine it carefully until later this week, but I spotted no traces of the old canvas on it, so don't know about the color issue. And I don't know how the Yankee differed from the Guide or the Otca -- perhaps you could tell me where to find descriptions. The only OT catalog I have dates from 1969. Just finished restoring a 1969 Otca, and this new one seems a bit less beamy and somewhat shallower.
The question about the serial number is that the first "1" digit almost looked as if it was made by the edge of the stamp, rather than an actual digit. But the light was bad and I had to scrape away a lot of dirt even to find the number, so I'll have to take a closer look when I get it into my back yard. The fact that the 1909 boat shipped to Minnesota suggests it would be unlikely to turn up here in Rochester.
BTW, you sent the build record for 110498 twice, once in each post. If you have the one for 10498, I'd appreciate receiving it too.
Thanks a lot for your help. I'll get back to you when I know a little more!
Roger Young
display sample collector
Thanks for those pages. Looks as if the Yankee is the right model -- the Guide appears to be available only in 18' or 20' lengths, and the Otca at that time had much longer decks and a coaming. This one has relatively short decks (which are now laying in the bottom of the boat!).
Greg Nolan
enthusiast
For a bit more information on the history of the OT name "Yankee," you might want to look at Dan Miller's posting at http://forums.wcha.org/showthread.php?t=3979
Mystery Solved!
Roger, et al. -
Looks as if the canoe is definitely 110498, now that I've been able to examine it carefully. That would make it the 1932 Yankee 16' model. The first "digit" is clearly a "1", not just an extra scratch. And to seal the deal, I found traces of Deep Orange paint on the gunwales. That would also indicate that the second build record for 110498 was misnumbered, and should be 110499.
I ordered Dan Miller's Old Town Catalogs CD to help me make sense of differences between OT's various models, now and in the future. And I'm going to try to figure out a little more about the history of this particular canoe, if I can track down the right people. Looks as if the boat isn't in bad shape for being 77 years old, and new decks, gunwales, keel, canvas and finish will make it good as new.
One other question: Does WCHA, or Old Town, or anybody, keep a serial number database of the owners of canoes that have been restored or that are still in good shape? I suppose you can register any Old Town canoe S/N with Old Town, but it seems as if it might be a good idea to have a WCHA database of who owns what.
Thanks again for your help!
Roger, et al. -
Looks as if the canoe is definitely 110498, now that I've been able to examine it carefully. That would make it the 1932 Yankee 16' model. The first "digit" is clearly a "1", not just an extra scratch. And to seal the deal, I found traces of Deep Orange paint on the gunwales. That would also indicate that the second build record for 110498 was misnumbered, and should be 110499.
I ordered Dan Miller's Old Town Catalogs CD to help me make sense of differences between OT's various models, now and in the future. And I'm going to try to figure out a little more about the history of this particular canoe, if I can track down the right people. Looks as if the boat isn't in bad shape for being 77 years old, and new decks, gunwales, keel, canvas and finish will make it good as new.
One other question: Does WCHA, or Old Town, or anybody, keep a serial number database of the owners of canoes that have been restored or that are still in good shape? I suppose you can register any Old Town canoe S/N with Old Town, but it seems as if it might be a good idea to have a WCHA database of who owns what.
Thanks again for your help!
Kathryn Klos
squirrel whisperer
Hi Dave,
Old Town used to keep track of inquiries about canoes on the back of the individual build record cards, but I doubt they do that anymore as they've discontinued record-keeping. If someone sends Old Town three dollars (I think that's the amount) and a series of digits, Old Town will supply a build record... but they don't really care if the numbers you send are on an Old Town canoe or are your dog's rabies tag number... or so it seems to me. Not being hard on Old Town... they are a business. In these forums, we try a bit more diligently to match the correct record to the canoe... 'cuz we're passionate about old canoes!
I think those who initially answered build record questions here in Forums kept track of who had what, but it became overwhelming... and many of the people asking for build records here don't necessarily have a canoe that's in good condition, or one that they are necessarily going to keep... or one that's even in their possession.
In the past, the WCHA kept lists of who had what... but that became overwhelming for whoever ponied-up for the job... one more task for the journal editor or whatever.
Denis and I have had great success and have learned a lot by volunteering to keep a Morris database. We also are working on a Gerrish database, in an effort to get an idea of the body of his work. The St. Louis Chapter keeps one regarding St. Louis canoes, and I think Dan Lindberg likes knowing who has the Seligas... so there are individuals among the WCHA members who have a special interest in a canoe-type and are keeping track.
Others here will have more information regarding the history of "keeping track".
Reading the WCHA journal and these forums, and going to the WCHA Assembly, are great ways to discover "what's out there."
Kathy
Old Town used to keep track of inquiries about canoes on the back of the individual build record cards, but I doubt they do that anymore as they've discontinued record-keeping. If someone sends Old Town three dollars (I think that's the amount) and a series of digits, Old Town will supply a build record... but they don't really care if the numbers you send are on an Old Town canoe or are your dog's rabies tag number... or so it seems to me. Not being hard on Old Town... they are a business. In these forums, we try a bit more diligently to match the correct record to the canoe... 'cuz we're passionate about old canoes!
I think those who initially answered build record questions here in Forums kept track of who had what, but it became overwhelming... and many of the people asking for build records here don't necessarily have a canoe that's in good condition, or one that they are necessarily going to keep... or one that's even in their possession.
In the past, the WCHA kept lists of who had what... but that became overwhelming for whoever ponied-up for the job... one more task for the journal editor or whatever.
Denis and I have had great success and have learned a lot by volunteering to keep a Morris database. We also are working on a Gerrish database, in an effort to get an idea of the body of his work. The St. Louis Chapter keeps one regarding St. Louis canoes, and I think Dan Lindberg likes knowing who has the Seligas... so there are individuals among the WCHA members who have a special interest in a canoe-type and are keeping track.
Others here will have more information regarding the history of "keeping track".
Reading the WCHA journal and these forums, and going to the WCHA Assembly, are great ways to discover "what's out there."
Kathy
Thanks, Kathy -
Yup, I'm sure it would be an enormous task to track any one manufacturer's canoes, OT's especially. I'd rather be out on the water, myself! Or working in the shop! But I'm glad to hear that you and others are keeping track of who owns Morris's, etc. I just thought that it would make the task of tracking down a boat's history a lot easier if someone were keeping records. Guess that's just my compulsive side shining through!
Yup, I'm sure it would be an enormous task to track any one manufacturer's canoes, OT's especially. I'd rather be out on the water, myself! Or working in the shop! But I'm glad to hear that you and others are keeping track of who owns Morris's, etc. I just thought that it would make the task of tracking down a boat's history a lot easier if someone were keeping records. Guess that's just my compulsive side shining through!
Kathryn Klos
squirrel whisperer
We can be grateful that Old Town kept records for all those years, that the company managed to survive long past the demise of other canoe companies, and that funds and personnel were available to the WCHA for scanning these records and Old Town agreed that they should be so preserved. It also seems very convenient that records for all boat-types are in the same serial number series, and each boat had its own card (or cards, if they returned enough times for repairs!).
Kathy
Kathy
