What have I bought?

[samb]

Like many who have an infatuation with old things, (canoes in this case), I keep a watch on the places they are likely to come up for sale. ‘Auction Watch’ covers all the auction sales in the UK and Ireland. Mostly it just brings up canoe shaped fruit dishes and the like, occasionally a pacific island canoe model but a couple of weeks ago it showed me ‘A late 19th Century American double ended peapod Canoe or Skiff’. It was in Ireland which was a bit of a problem travel wise, but the description said the provenance was from Eleanor Barnes.

This is important because Eleanor Barnes wrote “As the Water flows” (published 1920),
https://archive.org/details/aswaterflowsreco00barnrich/mode/2up

It’s one of the few UK written books about canoe touring in the UK at the beginning of the 20th century. I just happen to have a copy, and know it features both photos and watercolours of her canoe.

The book is a quite poetic description of a woman paddler and her young friend travelling by canoe on some of the rivers in the south of England, in an age when a lady wore a hat. I understand the book is based on diary entries from trips taken around 1914. It deals with the trials and tribulations of canoeing mostly on small rivers and in a country where landowners and fishermen have control over the rivers and also tells of the hospitality of country folk.

The book is illustrated with line drawings, watercolours and photographs.
There are a few interesting comments about the canoe through the text.

• . . . . . I bought an old canoe. I tried her cautiously in wintry weather on the Loch . .. . .
• I explained, it was a green canoe of lightest, frailest build, easily carried, easily trespassed with, over a Bridge or past a waterwheel.
• The green canoe weighs 30lbs, within is built of shavings of thin wood, without of canvas, covered with green paint of apple green or larch.

The description is obviously of a cedar / canvas canoe, but 30lbs? The photos don’t give the impression of an especially small boat:

But the watercolours suggest a very small canoe . . . and without seats. Eleanor, in the stern with the paddle, seems to have done all the work. Her friend Sabrina being all young and idealistic, just sits (and stands) and looks pretty.

Anyhow, to get back to the point,I won the auction and will be picking it up next week.
In the meantime, does anyone have an opinion on what I’ve just bought?
https://www.fonsiemealy.ie/catalogu...3daf24e1e6bf/making-room-spring-sale-lot-306/

Sam

 

[Benson Gray]

The dimensions show a canoe that is about 11.8 feet by 35.8 inches and the 1920 publication date of her book indicates something that was made in the teens. This is several years before most North American builders started listing canoes of that size in their catalogs as described at the link below. My guess is a made at home or in small shop by an experienced craftsman. Please let us know if you find any numbers on the inside stems or signs of a decal on the bow deck. Nice score,

Benson

11 foot canoes for Abercrombie & Fitch

The Assembly theme this year is Solo Canoes and Remembering Tom MacKenzie which may be generating a lot of excitement in the market for small canoes. Two interesting 11 foot solo canoes which shipped to Abercrombie & Fitch in the 1920s have sold recently. The oldest known 11 foot canoe from...

www.wcha.org

 

[MGC]

There is not a great deal to go on.
It is not possible to conclude that the canoe in the photographs is the same one that you bought. That does not obviate the provenance, but there are several details that need to be explored. First, as you note, the canoe in the photos does appear to be a longer canoe.
Second and the thing that stands out to me, the thwart in the canoe you purchased has been lowered below the inside rail. The canoe being paddled has the thwart mounted tight to the rail. In the photos and illustrations Eleanor is sitting on the bottom of the canoe. The only reason I can think of to lower the thwart would be for the purpose of sitting on it, to lower the CG. That does not match her apparent style.
I don't know where the photos were obtained? If there are others that show the painter ring and (what is it?) that are mounted on the canoe you purchased, that could help to confirm the provenance.
You should post additional and better images when you have the canoe in hand.

 

[Murat V]

Happened to search the same auction website for canoe items and noted that another green canoe was sold in the summer of 2022 from the same estate. Seems like Eleanor Barnes was like many of us and had more than one canoe in her fleet. This one shares the exact dimensions as your canoe but is a darker green and made with open gunnels. Might be reasonable to assume it was made on the same form. Perhaps you could try and locate the new owner and see if there are any other markings to ID the maker.

Deck shape is slightly different on this one, as seen in the photo HERE, so perhaps that might offer a clue? To my eyes, there looks to be a circular spot on the deck where there might have been a decal or metal name plate as well.

 

[samb]

Thanks for this Murat. I'd missed that one. Looks like mine was in the same sale, the lot before, but didn't sell.
I'm trying to get in touch with the seller through the auction house to see if I can get anymore information. I'll see if I can get a contact for the buyer of the one you found.
It had bothered me in the book that the watercolours showed shaped decks, while the one I'll be meeting on Tuesday has rounded chestnut type as seen in the black and white photos.
I obviously paid the right price, as the hammer price for both was the same.
It might be my imagination, but the one you found had the remnants of a chestnut decal; I thought that about mine too, but not so clear, but I'll know on Tueday.

Sam

 

[Andre Cloutier]

Sam, that looks fantastic. In my 1915 Chestnut catalog, and earlier ones as well, a 12' ( approximate, i have to dig it out) canoe is listed, iirc a Teddy in first grade, and Trapper in second grade. Given Canadian ties to England, there was a lot of trade done with watercraft, as you well know. The deck profile is the same, and pulling it back in a few inches for the broken thwart and some spread would yield about the same dimensions. It will be interesting to see if there was any hardware where the seats would have been, but of course a customer could order what they wanted as well. The painter ring seems similar for the period, and while its still speculation i imagine there are only a few manufacturers in North America that would produce that type of construction, narrowing it considerably. If Canadian in origin, it could only be a Chestnut however we cant exclude an American manufacturer entirely yet. Looking forward to seeing more details once in hand!

 

[Nick Dennis]

Happened to search the same auction website for canoe items and noted that another green canoe was sold in the summer of 2022 from the same estate. Seems like Eleanor Barnes was like many of us and had more than one canoe in her fleet. This one shares the exact dimensions as your canoe but is a darker green and made with open gunnels. Might be reasonable to assume it was made on the same form. Perhaps you could try and locate the new owner and see if there are any other markings to ID the maker.

Deck shape is slightly different on this one, as seen in the photo HERE, so perhaps that might offer a clue? To my eyes, there looks to be a circular spot on the deck where there might have been a decal or metal name plate as well.

View attachment 52682

The deck shape of the canoe sold earlier is reminiscent of a Peterborough deck as on my 16S as here

but my Old Town CR had a deck shaped similar

is that the ghost of a Chestnut decal on the deck?

I am sure research will reveal all……….eventually

 

[samb]

It seems the boat I have is one of two that belonged to Lady Yarrow / Eleanor Barnes. They had both been for auction in June '22 and mine didn't sell.

Unfortunately, it seems the sellers have no idea about the history. They have had these boats stored in their garage for years and the story they have is "they were bought by Lady Yarrow around the beginning of the 20th century and she went down the rivers of the Rockies in Canada on them and around southern England. That's all I know"

I've had no luck trying to get the other buyers contact.

The Yarrows (or Lord Yarrow and Miss Barnes as she was then) were in Canada in 1913 where they acquired the shipyard in Vancouver in 1914. Whether they canoed down the rivers in the Rockies or not, it would seem likely that canoeing would be on the agenda, at least for Eleanor, as Lord Yarrow was 72 years old by this time.
My one is a Chestnut, the deck of the other appears to me to be Peterborough as Nick suggests.

I’ve now got the canoe back home and have had a good look at it.

Feeling under the gunnels, I can feel the stubs of the original seat bolts. All the woodwork has been ‘done’ in a mahogany stained varnish. The canvas is original. There is the remains of a Chestnut decal on the bow deck, and a shadow from a river Thames license plate on the stern deck.

The highlights show a match to the ca.1908 decal as shown in Dick Perrsons guide shown here in post #6
It’s 12’ 1 ¾ “ long, a width of 34” and a top of plank to top of gunnel height of 14” so I’m happy I have 12” Teddy.



There are a number of historic repairs on the canvas; done probably by someone without the knowledge of cedar canvas boats I think. There is no sign of damage there inside so I imagine they are at places where the canvas was cut or gashed. It looks like the repairs consist of a patch of canvas with probably some sort of glue and then tacked around the edges. There is one internal repair which looks to be over damaged planking.

I’ll know more about these when I start to disassemble, but I might have to test it first, if I can do a temporary fix on the thwart. Probably worth taking duck tape with me!
Sam