Two unrelated questions.

Dave Wermuth

Who hid my paddle?
We just got our canoes back from the stripper here in SE Mi. The work is excellent. The price was high I thought. The PY Rainbow cost $600 to strip and the OT HW (without much finish) cost $250. How does that compare to what others are paying? Mind you it is excellent job with a rinse and neutralization. Both canoes are 17'.

And, am I correct in assuming that Penn Yan always used the slotted screw?
we are seeing phillips head currently.

thanks in advance.
When I was in Wisconsin, it was $10 per linear foot for varnish stripping. Probably more now, that was a few years ago!

Penn Yan used Reed and Prince screws which are sort-of-kind-of like Phillips.
lets see, $50/can for a gallon of green stripper, more for steel wool and gloves, face mask, 8 hours+ @ $20/hour, scorched lawn after rinsing and tsp, sore neck and back.:eek:
$600 is tolerable!
It was $500 to get an 16 ft OT Guide here in Albuquerque last month, his tank was to small to get it all in at one time, he said he spent a week on it. It was a good job. If it took him a week I suppose he earned his money.
Dave, $250 is quite reasonable for a 17' canoe that has only varnish. Painted interiors use a lot more stripper and are much more difficult to remove, but I would consider $650 high. If the canoe had fiberglass resin between the planks, then $650 probably isn't too far out of line for an excellent stripping job. Gil

Thanks Dan, i just was not sure about the type of screw and thought I'd heard something somewhere but couldn't recall.
And thanks Andre, Gil and Tom for your input/perspectives. this guy uses a machine that applies the stripper and then vacumms it off at the same time. He doesn't use a tank. The stuff then recycles thru. He bought a new 55 gal drum of stripper for this project. The PY still has some resin between planks on the outside but it looks as if it will pick out pretty easily now. WE told him to not strip the outside. the interiors are clean, clean, clean. The crevaces between plank and rib are perfect. Much better than I could have done on a warm summer's day. And he did the job in one day.
Dan Miller says:
When I was in Wisconsin, it was $10 per linear foot for varnish stripping. Probably more now, that was a few years ago!

Penn Yan used Reed and Prince screws which are sort-of-kind-of like Phillips.

I think V&L is up to about $13/ft now for normal varnish stripping. He charges extra if the finish is tough to remove, or painted.

For the PY, the drive system is Frearson Drive, developed and marketed by Reed and Prince. You will do yourself a favor by ordering some Frearson Drive Bits from Jamestown, or somebody. Most hardware stores don't carry them. Phillips drive bits will work, but tend to cam out. Using the frearson bits will make it easier to remove screws without damaging the drive recess.
In my early 20's I was a header operator at a fastener manufacturer.
I always hated orders with frearson drive recesses. The tooling seemed to wear out quickly as compared to Phillips, Pozi-Drive and Torx. Maybe that's why that style is not too common.
I paid a hair less then $13 per ft at V&L this past summer. Total for the 16' PY Rainbow was $198 with sales tax. Now if I just get the darn thing complete, the stripping cost will be worth it.
DRY power stripper, auto body .?

I just passed on a painted floor canoe offer yesterday. Talking to my son , who is a NAPA tech suppling the auto body shops, it seems a compressed air tool would be a good source for interiors.??
. Can use a variety of bag materials or different pressures. He is up in Maine & I am anxious to try a sample.

never considered it but sandblasting, or media blasting seems like it would be hard to keep from damaging the soft cedar. But may have advaNGTAGES over chemical stripping.
media blasting

In a word, DON'T DO IT. Once owned a beautiful Peterborough that the former owner had blasted, using walnut shell media if i remember - screwed the interior up and looked like driftwood. Glass, plastic, steel, nut shells, are all to aggressive at the psi you need to lift paint. It relieves the cedar like those house signs they make, with the raised wood and blasted backgrounds. Used to work for a blast company, if you dont believe me get some old cedar and give her a hit at about 60 or 70psi and you'll see the results. Soda will make an unbelievable mess, and doubt you'd want to pay for dry ice blasting.
Thanks for reminding me, Dave W. I havea pic of completed Rainbow hanging in the garage to keep me going. That's my motivation.
media blasting?

In a word, DON'T DO IT. Soda will make an unbelievable mess, and doubt you'd want to pay for dry ice blasting.

Andre, This would make an excellent demonstration at Assembly! Could you come up with small pieces of old, multiply painted wood that had been 'stripped' by these different methods, mount them on a board - like a poster, so folks know what they will get if they try each of the techniques? I've only heard about soda and dry ice blasting but would like to know more. What is the nature of the mess that soda blasting makes? Does dry ice blasting work, but very expensive?

By the way Toronto was near balmy last weekend, and hard to find snow there. Tom McCloud in Frederick, MD with 30 inches of snow on the ground!
Soda sends great clouds of dust everywhere, and is essentially sand so very abrasive, it used to be used a great deal in the restoration business, its benefit lay in the fact that it is very controllable and can remove layers more finely that a more coarse abrasive like steel shot or grit. However, for most mold remediations and such we use more dry ice these days, it evaporates and leaves no mess other than what is being blasted off. While it has become more cost effective its still pricey. The problem essentially is that the paint will not come off uniformly, and while this is not a problem when blasting metal, as you expose wood around an area you are working on, passing back and forth will continue to aggravate the wood that is exposed. I had to sand down the ribs on the boat i had that was blasted, but couldnt take too much off or the clenched tacks would have been sanded out as well. Forget sanding between the ribs too. All in all you're best just to go with a chemical stripper, no real way around it! You could take a piece of wood to a sign company that makes the really nice wood ones and get them to do a test piece, they basically lay out a rubber cutout of the main picture and blast all around it, leaving the area to be painted raised. I would not recommend this as a stripping technique at all, the thought of one of the guys at my old summer job hitting a soft cedar boat with grit at 100psi is frightening, it would kill a canoe.