Old Town Sailboat ID & Plans

[Isak]

I am beginning the restoration of the sailboat pictured below. I think it is an Old Town Sailing Dinghy, but I'm not sure. I have not been able to find any identifying markings, numbers, or plaques. It is missing its centerboard, mast, sail, and rigging. If you can positively identify this boat or recommend a pattern for fabricating the missing parts, I would greatly appreciate any information or advice you may have.

The dinghies on the Alden Designs website look similar. Would a boat like this be rigged like those sliding gunter designs?

Thanks.

Isak

 

[Mark Adams]

It looks nothing like the OT sailing Dinghy I have. The construction doesn't look like anything Old Town would have done either. As far as I know, OT never build boats with "strip" planking. Pretty boat though!

Benson will hopefully chime in.

 

[Benson Gray]

I agree with Mark that it doesn't look like an Old Town sailing dinghy. Old Town did build some Alden designs as described at http://forums.wcha.org/showthread.php?t=3988 but this doesn't look like one. Niels Helleberg at Alden should be able to help you identify if it is one of their deisgns. The sliding gunter rig was very common on small sail boats like this. Good luck with your restoration,

Benson

 

[Michael Grace]

Looks like it could be Thompson. Some features seem unusual, but it could be a model I haven't seen. The ribs, planking and breasthook all look like they could be Thompson, but I haven't seen that style of transom on a Thompson. Seats were mounted sometimes on full-length stringers, and sometimes on cleats as in your boat, so again, could be Thompson.

Michael

 

[Isak]

Thank you for your posts.

I don't know if the dimensions of the boat will help, but it's roughly 12' long, 4'6" wide at its widest point, 3' wide at the stern, and 12'6" along the gunwale.

Michael Grace: Do you know if there is anywhere I could find out more information about Thompson sailboats?

Thanks again.

Isak

 

[Kathryn Klos]

you are already where you need to go...

And usually, when you say "Thompson", Andreas and others who know these boats better than anyone will suddenly appear...

I have attached the picture of a 1953 Thompson dinghy, from the 1953 catalog in "The Thompson Brothers Boat Manufacturing Co. Catalog Collection" edited by Dan Miller and Benson Gray, which is available on CD from www.dragonflycanoe.com or in the WCHA store.

There are more images, but I thought this might be a place to start, for comparison.

Kathy

 

[Kathryn Klos]

Uploading a couple more images of the smaller Thompson craft... bear in mind that modifications could have been made... I only focused on what I thought were the same length as your boat.

 

[thompsonboatboy]

Yes, she does have the look of a Thompson Bros. Boat Mfg. Co. boat. However, they NEVER made a sail boat anything like that guy. Maybe it was one of their typical row/motor boats that someone converted into a sail boat????

As stated above, you can get the Thompson Boat et.al. brochures on CD-ROM at www.dragonflycanoe.com and right here at www.wcha.org

There are two Thompson Boat groups: www.thompsondockisde.com which has a nice discussion forum and the Thompson Antique & Classic Boat Rally, Inc. - the latter is a classic boat gathering/show held in the even years.

Andreas

 

[Isak]

That seems like it could be a very plausible explanation and the boat does look very similar to the Smooth Built Light Weight. The brackets that held the mast look like they could have been easily added by a previous owner.

The major difference I see is the centerboard apparatus, which is not in the catalog photo. Would a row/motor boat like this have a centerboard that rotated up into the boat? This seems like a pretty large alteration for a previous owner to make, but I guess it's possible.

Thanks,

Isak

 

[thompsonboatboy]

IF it is a Thompson Bros. Boat Mfg. Co. craft, it was NOT made as a sailboat. Someone after purchase modified it by turning a row/motor boat into a sailboat, including the centerboard trunk.

Thompson had hundreds of models of boats over the years, sometimes as many as 70 different models in a given year.

But they NEVER made a sailboat like you have in your photos. They did make sailboats, but they were one-off designs such as the Lightning, Seagull, Snipe, etc...

Andreas

 

[Isak]

Id #

I don't know if this will help, but I found a number on the piece of wood attached to the transom beneath the motor mounts where it juts up through the rear seat. The number is: 163873

 

[Benson Gray]

It appears that you may have an Old Town boat after all, although the sailing conversion appears to have been done after it left the factory. The Old Town with serial number 163873 is a 12 foot long, CS (Common Sense or middle) grade, round bottom boat model with a keel, outside stems, and a floor rack. It was built between July, 1955 and June, 1957. The original exterior paint color was bright red with a natural (clear varnished) inside, rails and seats. It was shipped on June 28th, 1957 to Brewer, Maine. A scan showing this build record can be found by following the link at the attached thumbnail image below.

These scans and several hundred thousand others were created with substantial grants from the Wooden Canoe Heritage Association (WCHA) and others. A description of the project to preserve these records is available at http://www.wcha.org/ot_records/ if you want more details. I hope that you will join or renew your membership to the WCHA so that services like this can continue. See http://www.wcha.org/wcha/ to learn more about the WCHA and http://www.wcha.org/join.php to join.

I have also attached the catalog page from 1956 that describes this boat. More information about this model can be found on the Old Town Canoe Company Catalog Collection CD-ROM which is available from http://woodencanoe.org/catalog/prod...d=404&osCsid=39f7e6f54228bc26faca437d11ded5cb and http://www.dragonflycanoe.com/orderform.html on the web.

The oval mast suppot and step indicates that an aluminum mast was installed which would probably be much newer than the boat.

It is also possible that they could have another number or manufacturer if this description doesn't match your boat. Feel free to reply here if you have any other questions.

Benson

 

[Mark Adams]

I'll be d*****d! The construction looks SO un-Old Townish. But it sure looks like the boat.

 

[Michael Grace]

Looks like this is the one according to the serial number. But what about that transom? The dorsal shape threw me with respect to both Thompson and Old Town. Maybe replacement? Did Old Town make transoms that curved upward toward center with round cutout?

And an unrelated question- The planking appears to be bead-and-cove. Was this normal for Old Town strip-built boats (or others)? Our Thompson has flat-edged planking, and our only Old Town boat is wood-canvas.

Michael

 

[Isak]

I've been scraping the hull and it's got a layer of bright red paint underneath, so that makes a lot of sense. Does anyone know if there's a picture of the 12' model in one of the catalogs? So, I guess if I want to return it to its original condition I need to take the centerboard trunk out. Would this be feasible or would it weaken the boat too much? Thanks for all the input.

Isak

 

[Benson Gray]

This boat was listed in the catalogs from 1937 to 1956 but only the 15 foot version was ever pictured as far as I can tell. I suspect that you could remove the centerboard trunk successfully since it was originally built without one. I haven't seen one of these models before so I don't know if the transom shape is original. The ten foot version of the flat bottom row boat from the 1956 catalog had a similar transom as shown below. My guess is that it and the bead and cove planking both probably came that way from the factory. Good luck with the restoration,

Benson