First Wood & Canvas Canoe - Repair Questions

[Thoepker]

Hello everyone!

I have been a silent viewer of the site for 7-8 months now, but I just bought my first W/C canoe and decided to join up and pipe up. I picked up a 1964 OT 15' 50lb. The boat was restored in 04 and overall is in great shape, though I do plan to do another complete restoration at some point. Right now, though, my goal is to perform some minor repairs and keep her afloat as is for the next couple of seasons. My preferred season in FL is fastly approaching.

I have some woodworking experience, but this will be a learning experience for me, to say the least. Here is my current plan for immediate issues I want to address:

PAINT​

I have several small chips in the paint, and I am trying to decide between sanding it down and going with a fresh coat of paint.

• Option 1: I have all the emails/details from the last restoration, and I know the paint is bright red Petit EzPoxy. I am considering ordering the paint to match and addressing the areas as needed.
• Option 2: Repaint. From what I have read, because it is an older canvas, I would be best suited to just keep it practical and go with a Rustoleum Marine grade paint until I recanvas. I would likely go with green instead of red. 2 Questions:
  • Would I need to remove the outwales to do this?
  • Would I need to remove the stem bands? If so, are there any considerations when reinstalling?

RIBS​

I have located a previous thread discussing wooden patches for ribs. I was going to source some white cedar stock and steam-bend the patches, blend the edges, sand down the varnish, and secure with Titebond 3 and some #8 3/4" silicon bronze screws into the existing rib.

The other option I have read is the use of an epoxy to seep into the crack itself.

This is the example I located.

PLANKING​

The last issue I see that needs to be addressed is a splintered plank. The canvas is not punctured, but it is soft due to the plank being compromised. I want to stiffen this back up and avoid further damage to the canvas.

This is the one I am a bit at a loss for (though my above intentions could be misguided as well). I understand the planking is Western Red Cedar 5/32". Mostly find White cedar planking available. I was considering cutting out the section from the inside, cutting a small plank section to match, and then securing it to a larger wooden patch and securing it to the adjacent planks with epoxy or glue.

This is the soft section.

Another similar section. Though still solid underneath, it is an example of the rib cracks.

I really appreciate the assistance in advance! Ready to learn!

 

[MGC]

Well, first, congratulations on a good first canoe. As has recently been a forum topic, the 50 pounders are held in high regard.
With respect to repairs. I lean towards keeping things simple and especially if there are plans to do a more major restoration in the not-so-distant future.
I have never patched a rib or plank with the canvas on and unless the cracks or breaks are causing a problem, I would leave them alone. What are the odds of more damage or a hit in the exact same spot? Epoxy will not find its way into the crack and most certainly not if varnish has already seeped. I would hold off on the repair until I had the canvas off and then either replace the ribs, or do backside repairs. If you think it must be sorted out now, I would put a piece over the rib much as is seen in the image you attached. I once noticed that one of Rollins canoes was repaired in that exact way, so that must be the right way to take care of it.
With respect to paint. Before doing anything, why do you have chips? Is the paint failing to hold to the filler or is the filler failing? The answer would determine my choice for how to proceed. Personally, I would lean toward saving the color change for a fresh canvas. The rails would be off at that time so you could more easily varnish them. I would definitely not take the bang plates off for a temporary paint job. Mask them.
If you do paint the entire canoe, be sure to sand the current paint enough so that there is adequate tooth for the new paint, but not so much that you get into the filler.
Spot painting, even with the "matching" paint is tough. The touched-up spots will almost certainly stand out.
By the way, for red cedar, old siding is almost always red cedar. A buddy of mine and I built two canoes using re-sawn cedar siding.

 

[Thoepker]

I can happily receive all these answers, as I usually do my maintenance outside of December-March. In FL, this is prime time for paddling as the tourists have cleared out, along with the hot/humid weather. My main concerns stem from wanting to ensure that I am not avoiding an opportunity to get the most out of the boat before the restoration (which again will likely be 2 yrs).

The paint damage looks to me more like mishaps on the water, and even more likely, entering and exiting the canoe. The wear is predominantly on the starboard side, which is the same side as the damaged planking. It looks like to me the previous owner entered and exited to this side while partially beached.

The spots are minor and as long as they do not compromise the integrity, they don't bother me. 100% understand the paint matching, but I do favor function over aesthetics in this case. With that, I will likely take the advice and hold off on repainting for now. The best boat is the one that gets you on the water.

I have been paddling a Wenonah Wilderness in Inegra/Kevlar layup with wood trim (oil-treated only) for the last 6 years. I always wet foot when loading/unloading, and I will do the same with this boat. After watching what Bill Mason put some boats through, I am pretty confident in their resilience.

 

[Dave Osborn]

From the photos and your plan to restore in two years, I’d say go paddle.
If the blemishes in the paint bother you, sand it out with 220 or 320 and repaint a couple coats. If you want to save $18 bucks, use Rustoleum. Otherwise any quality marine paint is fine.
The other stuff can all be tended to with the canvas off. BTW, don’t rely on epoxy seeping into the cracks as a repair. Once canvas is off, rib replacement or backside rib repairs can be done.

 

[Dan Lindberg]

I agree, go paddle it.
If the paint chips expose the canvas, just brush a small amount on just to protect it for now.

As for the broken ribs, as stated, trying to glue the joint won't work.
If they are very loose, glue a sister to the inside as a temp repair until a more complete repair can be done.
Feather the ends and it will be hard to see.

Dan

 

[Thoepker]

I appreciate all the replies and the pragmatic approach. I will pick up some paint just for some touch-ups and get out and enjoy the boat. The weather is getting just right down here, and the Okefenokee and Sante Fe are calling my name!

 

[Worth Gretter]

People have said that gluing the break won't help. If I had time and ambition, I would do a test. Take a strip of cedar, span a gap, and see how much weight it takes to break it. Then repeat with the glued strip.
Of course, the glued strip would not be 100% as strong, but maybe some significant fraction.
For an old canoe that needs to go one more year before a complete re-do, it might be worth it.

 

[Dave Osborn]

I actually do often epoxy the cracks. However, it is just to help stabilize the rib some for making a backside repair.
Remove the planking, put as much epoxy in the cracks as it will take. Clamp it to a form if needed to help bring the correct shape, if needed. Once cured, remove any clamps or form, scribe out a pocket, chisel to the correct depth and shape and epoxy the splint in, again, using a form with clamps, if necessary.

 

[MGC]

If I am following Dave's comment correctly, I more or less do the same thing. When you do a backside repair, the epoxy squeezes through the cracks and helps to stiffen the rib.
I would not apply epoxy to the rib from the top of the rib. Epoxy does not have much (any?) capillary action. It would not find its way into a crack unless you could somehow force it, and then, t would make it harder to do a proper backside repair if it is present.
I have paddled canoes with cracked ribs for many years before repairing them.... the canoe will let you know when it is time.