1948 Old Town Square Stern Canoe with Sponsons and AA Mahogany Decking

[scott64a]

Hey all,

I've recently become the owner of the above mentioned boat, or canoe, if you will.

It was purchased by my great-uncle Norman in the 50's, and was originally canvas. He re-skinned it in fiberglass and replaced the transom with marine grade plywood.

When my father got it in the early 90's, we went through it and re-glassed the keel from stem to stern, and refinished all of the cedar and mahogany, and replaced the knee braces and coaming behind the front decking with mahogany as well. We even got a cool decal from Old Town! It looked great when we were done! Still I remember having to use some bondo where the new glass ended to smooth the edge before painting.

Since then, it saw plenty of use on Quabbin, Sebago and Moosehead, and even got to go fish up on Eagle lake!
My father passed away a few years ago, and my brothers "repaired" the keel by glassing over the wood and screwing the brass guard back on.

Guess what?

It leaked!


So... here I am with a gorgeous Old Town, and would love to hear all of your input on how best to fix this one up. I filled it with water, and it leaked in a few spots along the bottom of the hull, and at the back corners where the transom is wrapped and the runners end. (I'm guessing they are called runners, but correct me if I'm wrong,) I know I'll have to take the keel, the runners, and the two long fins that run out at a 45 degree angle along the bottom of the hull in the back, and I'll have to either re-glass it or canvas it.

Questions I have:

Fiberglass or canvas? I'm sort of a purist, but I'd like durability, too... Besides, once it's painted... well, ya know. I don't have experience with canvas and would like to know if it's as durable as fiberglass.

If I DO decide to just re-glass it, do I have to strip the entire thing? Can I just run a 38" wide sheet from stem to stern? Will that hold up?

I don't like the idea of putting glass over old glass, and REALLY don't like the idea of using Bondo to smooth the transition areas.


I will get some pictures up tomorrow night.

Thanks for your input, in advance.

Scott

 

[scott64a]

Oh, and also...

Once the canvas or glass is on and done, how do you install the keel, bilge keels and ribs without having the boat leak?!?

They're screwed in, do I use some epoxy in the holes prior to mounting these?

 

[Fitz]

Canvas.

(Having recently run out of swear words to use while replacing the transom on a Chestnut that someone slathered in $&@:!glass.)

Search on "Fiberglass" for more opinions.

The canvas is filled with canoe filler.

The keels etc are bedded with bedding compound to prevent leaks.

Keep us posted and good luck with your restoration.

 

[scott64a]

Is it as durable as fiberglass?

I managed to dig up the paperwork on this boat, my dad had already contacted Old Town and gotten a copy of the original P.O..
Shipped on July 18th, 1948.

What type of canvas does one need? I don't have a barn or garage to do this in yet, but intend to do a proper restoration. Also in my dad's stuff was a copy of The Wood and Canvas Canoe, which I'd intended to get.

From what I see on the P.O., it was canvassed, filled three times, colored, trimmed and varnished twice.

If canvas lasts as long as fiberglass, I may go that route. I'd have to replace the transom in that case though... Plywood won't cut it.

 

[scott64a]

hehe I guess I'll read The Wood and Canvas Canoe.

This project doesn't have to be done right away... I can always run glass in a strip 30 inches wide down the keel, re-seat the keels and use it until I have a shop suitable to do a proper canvassing job. The girlfriend and I are house shopping...
My only requirements are sunny enough land to have a good sized garden and a garage big enough to do such a job.

 

[Fitz]

Hi Scott:

Filled canvas is very durable and likely much better for your boat in the long run. You might have to worry about punctures from a sharp stick or nub on a log, but you would have to worry about that with fiberglass too. I urge you to search around on here for discussions about the pros and cons of canvas vs. fiberglass. I think canvassing and filling is much easier than glassing and you may end up with a lighter boat. Also you don't have to go this route alone. You may live near a WCHA chapter or member who could offer assistance.

A shop is not necessary. DAMHIKT

 

[Grandlaker]

If you could put some Pictures on here it would be of great help. It sounds to me like you need a new keel, stern, stem, and a few patches, All can be done without stripping the glass.It can look Like this one.

 

[scott64a]

I'll take some pictures of it in the next couple of days. I've decided I will indeed canvas it, and replace the plywood with mahogany. I've got all of the original brass fixtures, it should look really good when it's done.

I can see without even stripping it that some of the planking is cupped, and it may be because of the fiberglass. Either way, it MAY be that a few extra tacks here and there will fair those. If not, I'll replace planking as needed.

My biggest obstacle will be joining the new transom to the hull. If the rearmost band is solid, and usable, I'll still have to make a rabbet joint into the transom.


Does anyone have any drawings of how Old Town did those transoms?

Grandlaker, I could easily just strip the paint and pull all keels, re-bed them after a sheet of glass from the waterline down and it'd fish for a while. That won't fix it properly, and it wouldn't look as good as the one you've pictured above. It already has who knows how many layers of glass on it... and it's warping the hull somewhat.

 

[Grandlaker]

Sounds like you got a plan. When in doubt strip it and start fresh. I posted some pictures on your other post about your stern Get some Pictures up of your canoe

 

[Easternrivers]

If you could put some Pictures on here it would be of great help. It sounds to me like you need a new keel, stern, stem, and a few patches, All can be done without stripping the glass.It can look Like this one.
View attachment 25032View attachment 25033View attachment 25030View attachment 25031

That's Beautiful! HAd to say....