Suggestions on dealing with too many tack holes in my stems?

[Easternrivers]

Before I close up the planking at the stems, I think I need to deal with the numerous tack holes and slight splits that I'm afraid may not hold tacks and screws well enough once canvas is applied.
I've heard of using scewers glued into the holes, or cutting down the stems and laminating new face wood over the existing. What would be the best way to cut down the stem face? I think a belt sander would do it.
And I guess all the planking tacked to the stems need to be removed or at least spread out to again good access. Any suggestions on how to deal with this issue?

 

[Larry Meyer]

I’m not the best person to answer this, but yes you need to be concerned about old stems that have been really beat up by the number of fasteners that they have had to hold onto. I know that Steve Lapey and Fitz commonly slather a lot of epoxy on the 3 faces of stems that are going to get a fresh onslaught of tacks, staples, and stem band screws. Cutting down the face of a stem and laminating a fresh surface is possible, but even then you’re just refreshing one face of the stem.

 

[robin]

I have seen toothpicks glued into the holes, then cut and sanded smooth.

 

[Easternrivers]

I’m not the best person to answer this, but yes you need to be concerned about old stems that have been really beat up by the number of fasteners that they have had to hold onto. I know that Steve Lapey and Fitz commonly slather a lot of epoxy on the 3 faces of stems that are going to get a fresh onslaught of tacks, staples, and stem band screws. Cutting down the face of a stem and laminating a fresh surface is possible, but even then you’re just refreshing one face of the stem.

Dumb as I am, I did not really consider the side facets of the stem! sheesh!!! thanks for turning on the lightbulb for me. LOL.
There must be some wood putties out there that hold nails/tacks without breaking up... I have seem these claims on some, but often wondered...there is a two part epoxy wood putty-filler that makes the claim. I do have a bit of that to try...maybe do a TEST sample first....

 

[Larry Meyer]

Planking can get reattached to the stem with very small screws, instead of tacks. With screws you can predrill the attachment points. The front narrow face of the stem is going to get a lot of fasteners: staples (or tacks) to hold the canvas, then brass screws for the stem band. Since the stem band screws go in after the canvas is stapled on and the canvas filled and painted, you then can’t see where your staples or tack heads are. And that means you are likely going to hit some staples when you drill holes for your (soft) brass stem band screws. The fix is to first use steel screws (the same size as your brass stem band screws) to clean out the holes for your brass stem band screws. If you hit a staple with your brass stem band screw, you will screw up that screw.

 

[Easternrivers]

That's a great tip on the stem band screws. I'll be sure to use that one.

 

[Larry Meyer]

There are several good posts about stem band installation, which can be tricky, if you have not some experience with metal work. Predrilling holes (that is, before you bend the band to the curve) can result in breaking the band at the holes, just for example. The screws should be a good tight fit in the hole. Experiment with your drill bits on a scrap of band and a piece of wood to get just the right drill bit and depth. You may need one bit for the band and a slightly smaller one for the wood. You want to drill clean through the band, but just make a pilot hole in the wood.

 

[Ed Moses]

A front applied 1/8" to 3/16" strip of white oak to the stem affixed with West System epoxy has worked well for me. The front strip is applied full length of the stem where canvas tacks or staples are to be re-applied. If I have had to replace the tips of the stem due to rot from overturned ground storeage, I generally also install a backer to the stem well above and below the splice with another appropriately thinned strip of w. oak.

Creative application of thin side strips to the stem can likely solve the issue of splits in the sides of the stem if you have them and will give you a fresh, surface for good fastener retention whether it be #3 , 3/8" or 1/2" brass screws or canoe tacks. I like to use screws to re-attach planking to the sides of the stems - makes for a more harmonious outcome and eliminates pounding in nails.

Larry is spot on with his stem band & screw advice.

 

[Easternrivers]

Why screws for the planking? Because of better grip? I have already spliced in new stem wood and also backed both splices.
If I want to add a lamination of oak, ash whatever to the stem face, is it necessary to sand down the stem to match the thickness of the added lamination, or do I just fair in the planking to the added stem thickness, ie. the thickness means that original planking will be slightly short of meeting the sides of the stem. If you get my meaning.

 

[Ed Moses]

When I encounter an old rotted top, fastener riddled stem face I'm always torn between replacing the entire stem or doing as described earlier. Generally all new planking is being applied in the area of the stem retrofit because of splitting on the thinned out ends and fastener removal so there generally is no planking length issue with the thin strip epoxied on the stem face. But if you are dealing with old planking, fairing for fit should work. I would not attempt sanding the stem face back unless planking is held out of the way or you will likely further shorten the planking length.

I've used #3 screws to attach planking to the stem ever since recommended by Bill Clements many years ago primarily because of the improved gripping that screws provide especially in old , riddled or cracked stem sides in addition to eliminating pounding on old wood that never seems fail to create some additional issues. I predrill into the stem and countersink the planking for a flush screw head fit. Any predrilled pilot holes that feel that they do not go into solid stem wood get a hardwood filler plug piece titebond III or epoxied in . Screwing is more costly and takes a tad more time but IMHO results in a nicer finished and more secure repair.

If you were to keep track of the time required for an old stem complete retrofit X 2 you might also come to the conclusion that less time might have been required to put in 2 totally new stems!!!!!

 

[Easternrivers]

Ya, I was hoping to get away with only the stem head repair splice, but I now understand that the planking in the ends likely will be replaced, so that makes a lot more sense to me now...I'll just sand enough to smooth the stem and provide a good surface to accept the lamination and go from there. replacing the entire stem on both ends seems quite daunting to me..this is my first repair job.
BUT, that being said, I think I'll take a closer look this weekend, and decide on the best course of action.
Thanks a lot.

 

[Larry Meyer]

It’s just that screws are better than tacks because it’s a gentler on the stem than pounding in a tack. When the canoe was first made, these planks extended past the stem, then were trimmed back, so tacking was acceptable as it wouldn’t split the plank and the stem was fresh and new. Plus the plank was likely wet. Just use the old tack holes in the planks. Pounding a tack in an old tack hole in the stem is no good. It’s a minor difference though.
I would say you don’t need to be too worried if the ends of your planks don’t extend quite as far as, or end up completely flush with, the new face of your stem. Where these planks overlap the stems, they are likely beveled back. This is all getting covered with canvas drawn taught.