Old Town #50 Weight Question

[Ken Chester]

I've owned this canoe for 20 years #102949 and have the build sheet. I bought it from the second owner that did some repair on it according to his daughter, as he had died a few months earlier. He only lived two camps up the lake in Dracut MA from the original purchaser. My question is on the weight of the canoe. The catalog page says it weighed 52 lbs at 15 feet long. Recently my wife and I were on a 25 mile long canoe trip which had one 1/4 mile long portage. My wife said there's now way this canoe only weighs 52 lbs. When we got back home I got on the scale, then picked up the canoe and got back on the scale. It weighed in a 71 lbs. Would it have soaked up water during our trip or layers of paint and varnish add 19 lbs? Thanks for your answers if you can help solve the mystery.

 

[Benson Gray]

My wife said there's now way this canoe only weighs 52 lbs. When we got back home I got on the scale, then picked up the canoe and got back on the scale. It weighed in a 71 lbs. Would it have soaked up water during our trip or layers of paint and varnish add 19 lbs?

Welcome, the short answer is yes, everything seems to gain weight over time and canoes are no exception. It also appears that the weights listed in the catalogs were optimistic. This model was introduced in the 1910 catalog and the weight was listed as 50 pounds. Your canoe shipped in 1930 and the catalog weight had increased to 55 pounds. It was 58 pounds in the 1966 catalog when the model name was changed to the Lightweight. The 2009 catalog was the last one to list this model as the Trapper at 68 pounds.

I once owned a fifty pound model built in 1914 as shown at http://www.wcha.org/forums/index.php?threads/3968/ that weighed 63 pounds after the restoration. Another one from 1938 weighed 67 pounds with open gunwales, a keel, floor rack, sailing seat, mast step, and rudder gudgeons. Both of these weights were from a bathroom scale when the canoes were relatively dry.

Wooden canoes also soak up water in use but I haven't ever actually measured this. Many years ago I ran a canoe program at a summer camp. The wooden canoes were always significantly heavier when we put them away in a barn for the winter than they were when we took them out at the beginning of the season.

Therefore, your canoe probably didn't start at 52 pounds and clearly has gained some weight from paint, varnish, repairs, and water over time. Please store it in a dry place during the winter, weigh it in the spring, and report back here on how much of the weight was water. Thanks and good luck,

Benson

 

[MGC]

They also increase in weight during the carry at a rate proportional to the length of the canoe and proximity to the end of the carry...at least that has been my experience. My 20 foot White starts out a trip at about 97 pounds...after a few days in the water it weighs about 110 plus. At the end of the first mile of a two mile carry it weighs about 500 pounds and it weighs close to a thousand by the end of the carry.

 

[Ken Chester]

Ha, ha. I read your notes, then read them to my wife we both got a nice chuckle, thank-you. I will be storing the canoe away in the basement that has a dehumidifier keeping it at 50% RH. During the winter the basement is often around 30% RH, so it should quite dry by the time snow and ice have left for the season here in northern NH sometime next May.

 

[Rob Stevens]

Extra weight is also added by sand getting between the planking and canvas. That weight won't "dry up" over the winter.

 

[MGC]

Ha, ha. I read your notes, then read them to my wife we both got a nice chuckle, thank-you. I will be storing the canoe away in the basement that has a dehumidifier keeping it at 50% RH. During the winter the basement is often around 30% RH, so it should quite dry by the time snow and ice have left for the season here in northern NH sometime next May.

A few years ago my wife and I went on a paddle ..23 miles of paddling, 11 miles of carrying. After the first day she asked me why we hadn't done this route before and I replied, too many carries... I guess you had to be there.
At any rate, after we finished I was telling her that it was time to get a lighter canoe for such routes, the old Morris was too much for me....doable but the suffering was more than I cared to repeat. We agreed to pick up a really light boat for our next trip. I ended up with a Swift Kevlar boat...it weighs in at about 43 pounds...... not the lightest but by our standards a literal feather.
Here's the interesting thing we learned...unlike our wood and canvas canoes...it finishes the trip at the same weight it starts out at....that's pretty cool...but here's the other thing. The thing about the increase in weight during the carry at a rate proportional to the length of the canoe and proximity to the end of the carry...that still happens. This lovely looking high tech light as a feather canoe starts out the carry at 43 pounds and by the middle of the carry, it's up to 500 pounds and by the end, you guessed it...1,000 pounds right on the nose. This may be the reason that folks resort to wheels or take routes without carries.

 

[Ken Chester]

A few years ago my wife and I went on a paddle ..23 miles of paddling, 11 miles of carrying. After the first day she asked me why we hadn't done this route before and I replied, too many carries... I guess you had to be there.
At any rate, after we finished I was telling her that it was time to get a lighter canoe for such routes, the old Morris was too much for me....doable but the suffering was more than I cared to repeat. We agreed to pick up a really light boat for our next trip. I ended up with a Swift Kevlar boat...it weighs in at about 43 pounds...... not the lightest but by our standards a literal feather.
Here's the interesting thing we learned...unlike our wood and canvas canoes...it finishes the trip at the same weight it starts out at....that's pretty cool...but here's the other thing. The thing about the increase in weight during the carry at a rate proportional to the length of the canoe and proximity to the end of the carry...that still happens. This lovely looking high tech light as a feather canoe starts out the carry at 43 pounds and by the middle of the carry, it's up to 500 pounds and by the end, you guessed it...1,000 pounds right on the nose. This may be the reason that folks resort to wheels or take routes without carries.

Fun story for sure. I recently built an off road canoe cart with 16" wheels. It works very well here in the mountains where remote lakes abound, however, I left it on the porch during our recent trip. I often canoe alone on these mountain adventures, so the cart is usually needed. We have toyed with the idea of a lighter canoe an probably will get a couple of the ultra light models to use, but the Old Town #50 now #71 is a so quiet an beautiful to paddle.

 

[MGC]

We have toyed with the idea of a lighter canoe an probably will get a couple of the ultra light models to use, but the Old Town #50 now #71 is a so quiet an beautiful to paddle.

The Kipawa that we bought is a decent hull, paddles well, is light, it's fairly quick, has a bit of wood trim to help the aesthetic...but it's Kevlar and neither of us enjoy the ride. It has a lifeless feel to it under the paddle. It has been used far less than I though it would be. It also has webbing on the seats. I thought that would be great but it turns out that I really can't stand it. It grips you. I'm used to being able to shift around on the seats in my wooden canoes...this one doesn't let me do that.

 

[Dan Lindberg]

Carrying a light canoe is why many canoes in the BW are kevlar, probably second only to aluminum. Either cheap or light.

BTW, wheels wouldn't be much help in the BW/Q, even if they were legal, which they are not.

Dan

This may be the reason that folks resort to wheels or take routes without carries.

 

[MGC]

Carrying a light canoe is why many canoes in the BW are kevlar, probably second only to aluminum. Either cheap or light.

BTW, wheels wouldn't be much help in the BW/Q, even if they were legal, which they are not.

Dan

A few years back my son and I were heading into Mud Pond Carry, between Umbazooksus and Mud/Chamberlain. We had met a NFCT through paddler at Gero Island the night before...light Hornbeck, making a run at the record time, using wheels on the carries and putting his bag of gear in the boat for one way carries.... this carry cracked him....we ended up helping him with his gear after he realized that wheels don't work where the trail is covered with 2 feet of water and blow downs... they work well on herd paths and roads.

 

[Ken Chester]

A few years back my son and I were heading into Mud Pond Carry, between Umbazooksus and Mud/Chamberlain. We had met a NFCT through paddler at Gero Island the night before...light Hornbeck, making a run at the record time, using wheels on the carries and putting his bag of gear in the boat for one way carries.... this carry cracked him....we ended up helping him with his gear after he realized that wheels don't work where the trail is covered with 2 feet of water and blow downs... they work well on herd paths and roads.

I've only used the wheels twice. They worked fine for one of the trails I used them on, but the other trail was steep and had stumps along with frequent sharp turns. The wheels came off on my way back up the hill when they got hung up on a stump. Did I mention there were rocks too? They are not a perfect solution, but make access to some areas easier than without. The many remote ponds up here in northern NH are beautiful places to paddle, so during the 2019 season I will certainly get to some of them on my radar.

 

[Dave Wermuth]

I re restored a 1920 15'er that weighed 57#. After I finished, it was up to 59#'s. It's hard to keep weight down. Sometimes a bigger canoe or longer carry brings to mind that the thing weighs Four ounces less than a battleship.