Morris #158 gunnel attachment questions?

[gfatula]

Preparing to put the original gunnels back on #158 I wanted to ask for advice. It was over 25 years ago when I removed the gunnels. I did order materials to re canvass at that time. Canvass, tacks, tools and brass finishing nails. I am not remembering but am assuming I ordered the nails to replace the ones that had been holding the gunnels on.

The only marks on the gunnels appear to be finish nail holes. There are small screw holes at the tips of each one. Nothing penetrates the inside surface of the inwales.

I plan to drive the new nails in at a slight angle, two per rib, thru each rib into the inwale. Screws will finish the ends.

Here are some pictures. If you know of this attachment process please share your knowledge.

Thanks,

George

 

[Dave Osborn]

George,
The Morris canoes that I've worked on all used brass escutcheon pins to hold the gunwale caps on.
I buy mine from Jamestown Distributors...
Dave

 

[gfatula]

George,
The Morris canoes that I've worked on all used brass escutcheon pins to hold the gunwale caps on.
I buy mine from Jamestown Distributors...
Dave

Dave,

Thanks for the reply. I don't see the marks from a fastener with any type of a head. Only finish nails could have left the marks, I think.

The rails are open. No caps.

George

 

[Dave Osborn]

Well George, then you've answered your own question.... Maybe Bert Morris ran out of escutcheon pins and used finish nails one day.
What is typical of Bert Morris canoes, and gives a really classy look is escutcheon pins.

 

[JClearwater]

George,
On my 1904 Old Town the gunwale caps and side caps were held on by small common nails. In other words they had a flat head. The canoe was in very good shape when I got it so I had no reason to think that the nails were not original so when I restored it I used common nails again in the same holes. In the two other canoes with closed gunwales I've worked on I used escutcheon pins as Dave suggested. I do think they look classy. In your case, if you are planning to use the old holes, a nail with a head ie:escutcheon pins, may hold better and work out better in the long run.

Good luck with your project. Looking forward to seeing pictures.

Jim

 

[gfatula]

Well George, then you've answered your own question.... Maybe Bert Morris ran out of escutcheon pins and used finish nails one day.
What is typical of Bert Morris canoes, and gives a really classy look is escutcheon pins.

Dave,

Just wondering if I could find someone who has a Morris with this attachment as an original "style". Not really a question except for the request for input. #158 is a rowing pod, not a "canoe" and may have been built to a different standard. I don't know.

Thanks,

 

[Dave Osborn]

George,
I have no familiarity with any Morris rowing craft, other than a 18' Morris Canoe that has factory original row locks on it. It has escutcheon pins on the cap and outwale as is typical of any other Morris I have restored, or seen.

I looked at Morris caps and outwales that are in my shop currently, and I can see where one could surmise that the holes were made from finish nails, however I pulled and saved escutcheon pins from them. The pins had been painted and varnished several time. When I tapped them out they took some wood with them making the holes irregular and seemingly not made from a nail with a head.
You may try to contact Kathrym Klos, our resident Morris expert, or some of the Maine restorers, for
additional experience in Morris fastenings.

Being a rowing pod, it could have had different fastenings, but in my opinion, it is doubtful.

 

[gfatula]

George,
I have no familiarity with any Morris rowing craft, other than a 18' Morris Canoe that has factory original row locks on it. It has escutcheon pins on the cap and outwale as is typical of any other Morris I have restored, or seen.

I looked at Morris caps and outwales that are in my shop currently, and I can see where one could surmise that the holes were made from finish nails, however I pulled and saved escutcheon pins from them. The pins had been painted and varnished several time. When I tapped them out they took some wood with them making the holes irregular and seemingly not made from a nail with a head.
You may try to contact Kathrym Klos, our resident Morris expert, or some of the Maine restorers, for
additional experience in Morris fastenings.

Being a rowing pod, it could have had different fastenings, but in my opinion, it is doubtful.

Dave,

Seeing some photographs to compare fastener holes would be interesting. Can you share any?

George

 

[H.E. Pennypacker]

It seems everyone is focused on caps, but you said your boat has open gunwales. At least on later Morris canoes that had open gunwales, the outwale was nailed on from the inside using finishing nails, just as Kennebec did. The nails were prone to rusting and they make it harder to get outwales off intact. So either restore to original if you want authenticity, or use screws if you want something that will be easier to work on in the future if necessary. Hope this helps.

 

[gfatula]

It seems everyone is focused on caps, but you said your boat has open gunwales. At least on later Morris canoes that had open gunwales, the outwale was nailed on from the inside using finishing nails, just as Kennebec did. The nails were prone to rusting and they make it harder to get outwales off intact. So either restore to original if you want authenticity, or use screws if you want something that will be easier to work on in the future if necessary. Hope this helps.

Thanks for your reply. Yes, #158 has open gunwales. No caps. In my previous discussions about this boat with Kathryn, she says it is a boat little is known about. I am fairly sure the holes in the outwales are finish nail holes. Since there are no marks, let alone holes in the surface of the inwales, no fasteners ever penetrated from the inside out. My conclusion is, it was nailed with brass finishing nails from the outside. I will use brass finish nails and re attach the outwales as the evidence suggests. It is tempting to change to screws for the ease of future repairs but I managed to get them off and others before me so original wins.

The actual installation is still weeks away. Other projects are underway (a unique White is also in the "works") and I want to let the second filler coat (50/50 filler and finish paint) cure for several weeks before the 3rd and 4th coats of finish. Gunnel installation after that, which will probably take me to October or November. It is my boat so no rush. Sorry I missed this year's WCHA with it. Perhaps next year. It would be fun to bring the White and the Morris but not likely.

The E.M. White is an 18' lapstrake skiff built in 1964 by White Canoe Company. E.M White Canoe Company' brass id plate is still in place along with a Cuprinol id plate. It has twin 40hp Johnson obms and sits on its original Sterling trailer. The po lost the mahogany windshield before putting it in storage 30+ years ago. Along with building a replacement windshield I will go over the boat and restore it to its original appearance. No damage or rot. The boat is pristine and both motors run now that I have tinkered with them. Fun!

I welcome further input. I have plenty of time to "listen".

George

 

[divedog]

My ca. 1905 closed gunwale Morris had escutcheon pins for the caps, which I prefer. I have a ca. 1913 open gunwale Morris with Mahogany rails and decks. The short caps on the decks and the center piece are held on with finishing nails and stained filler. Also, I forgot to mention that some of the escutcheon pins on the '05 were pounded in pretty deep in the Spruce rail caps. That could leave a hole like a finish nail, too.

 

[gfatula]

My ca. 1905 closed gunwale Morris had escutcheon pins for the caps, which I prefer. I have a ca. 1913 open gunwale Morris with Mahogany rails and decks. The short caps on the decks and the center piece are held on with finishing nails and stained filler. View attachment 32462 Also, I forgot to mention that some of the escutcheon pins on the '05 were pounded in pretty deep in the Spruce rail caps. That could leave a hole like a finish nail, too.

Thank you for replying, divedog. I am thinking... brass finishing nails from the outside with 4 screws, one at the tips of each gunnel. The original gunnels have a nice shape set so there won't be much shape "holding" other than the rail's in place attachment.

George