Vintage Canoe For Sale In Restaurant????

[WoodNCanvas]

I have found canoes for sale in old barns or sheds....cottages....certainly many online....but the following is the strangest ad I've seen lately:

This is the ad from Kijiji, http://ontario.kijiji.ca/c-buy-and-...-in-restaurant-for-5-years-W0QQAdIdZ319491806:

Vintage Canoe, been on display in restaurant for 5 years

As best I can tell this is from the 1920 - 1930 era. It is all wood interior and the 2 seats are sinew I beleive.

It has been on display in our restaurant for 5 years + and now it is time to move on.
The canoe has some screws in it and screw holes in it from where it was mounted to sit on its side and also for some of the decorations that were in it. The front has a crack in it as seen in the picture, this just needs a little TLC

I have seen restored canoes that look like this sell for $7200

I think the advertiser is being overly optimistic on the price of this canoe....and the canoe has been used as a display item in the restaurant for a number of years....the restaurant is in my area and I may take a closer look....seller is selling by 'biggest bid takes it'....

I have attached a few photos from Kijiji ad....



But I wonder if this canoe might be of some value....first the longer decks are interesting....and what appears to be closed gunwale construction....and being a canoe bought for display I wonder if it might be American built rather than Canadian....

I am not involved in the sale of this canoe....came across it online looking for old canoes to be restored in a youth program I'm involved with....but thought if this canoe was of heritage interest that it might be worth looking at....rather than see it become a canoe shelf/bookcase....

 

[WoodNCanvas]

Last two photos from Kijiji ad....




Any ideas on what this canoe may be???? Is it worth pursuing, if can be had for reasonable price????

 

[Dave Wermuth]

I look forward to what the experts say on this. My kinder thoughts are that the individual is not well versed in w/c canoes and mistakenly has over rated his canoe. Sinew? That choice of word makes me suspicious. Sinew is a word likely chosen to pique one's impulse to buy. ANd 'I've seen these sell for $7200'? Has anyone here ever seen one sell for that much? And if it is restored it doesn't look like that. I don't know what it is. And I really have no particular expertise but I think this is an offer based on not knowing much about wood canoes and the seller is going to be disappointed. There's this Duluth pack on ebay for sale for 50-60K---- Perhaps I'm out of the loop.

 

[Dan Miller]

Can't see the details well enough, but I would guess a double-gunwale Old Town... with a really horrendous fiberglass job.

 

[WoodNCanvas]

Thanks Dan....I thought that was a fiberglassed hull....and not well done at that either....I didn't think it was worth following up on....and I totally agree with Dave....I believe the seller is expecting way too much....I did email him, offering to take it off his hands for free if he wanted to donate it to the youth restoration program....if he needed to get rid of it then I might be willing to take it....but only if it was able to be made 'seaworthy'....which I don't think it is....especially if fiberglassed....and I also noted I felt it was likely worth very little if anything, probably no more than a couple of hundred dollars....and that it needed a lot of work....

 

[WoodNCanvas]

OK so I just did a Search on WCHA forum for double gunwales....if Dan is correct and it is an Old Town double gunwale, as described in http://forums.wcha.org/showthread.php?3823-Double-gunwales&highlight=double+gunwale, in response by Benson Gray:

Originally Posted by Michael Grace
I don't know how common double gunwale canoes are- I've seen very few of them relative to open or closed gunwales... perhaps less than 1% of canoes had them...

The Old Town database as described at http://www.wcha.org/ot_records/ only has two references to canoes with double mahogany gunwales so that is a bit small to make a reasonably accurate estimate of the total. I have come across a number of them while searching through old records so Michael's suggestion of less than 1% is probably correct. (Benson's reply).

So does this mean this is a canoe worth looking at???? Is it that rare???? Even worth possibly restoring if it can be had at a reasonable price????

 

[Gil Cramer]

Yes, it's worth a look. The rails and decks might be ok, and it could be a 16'er. A bad fiberglass job is usually easier to remove than a good one. Of course, it has some issues, but it's probably over 100 years old.

 

[WoodNCanvas]

Thanks Gil....I think I'll take a look at it then....

 

[WoodNCanvas]

So I sent the following responses to this Kijiji ad:

As I said in an earlier post I did suugest the seller donate the canoe to the youth program I am involved with:

I'm interested in the canoe....for use possibly in a youth canoe restoration program....it obviously needs a lot of work....if it could be restored to get it back into the water....I'm not interested in as a display but as a canoe....I also can't offer much....if any money....but if you would like to donate the canoe to help youth I can provide a good home....pick it up....and send you updates including photos of the work the youth do

It cetainly isn't worth much as is....maybe a couple of hundred dollars at most....probably less....it certainly is not worth anything close to $7200

But if you need it moved....I might be able to take it off your hands....

I have yet to receive a reply....and after finding this might be a rare canoe and worth saving, I resent the following response:

I sent an earlier query regarding this canoe....but have received no reply....I hope my offer of providing a way to donate the canoe to a youth restoration program was not found insulting....nor my remarks regarding its likely worth....that was not my intention....

I would be interested in considering purchasing the canoe....but I would have to take a close look at it before making an offer....from the photos the canoe appears to be fiberglassed....and to be properly restored it would need to be removed and replaced with canvas....as I stated before this canoe would require a lot of work to restore it properly.....and is certainly not worth anywhere near $7200 even fully restored....but I would be willing to offer a fair price if the make and model of the canoe can be determined....

I am also willing to still take the canoe for restoration in the youth program I am involved in....and even considering doing the work at a reasonable cost so that the canoe could be sold by yourself for more money than it currently would bring....

I look forward to your reply....

I'll keep you posted on the outcome of all of this....unless I have 'sold' the canoe to somebody here already....

 

[WoodNCanvas]

I haven't heard back from the seller yet....but am hoping to get a chance to check this canoe out....if it is indeed an Old Town double gunwale canoe....and as old as it seems....but needing an extensive restoration....can anyone advise on a fair price to offer???? I'm really not sure what to offer if I do get a chance....

 

[WoodNCanvas]

I went to see the canoe yesterday....but I couldn't determine if it was actually an Old Town double gunwale canoe or not since I couldn't get close enough to see a serial number....the canoe is fiberglassed but not very well (which as Gil Cramer pointed out earlier could be a good thing)....I also heard back from the seller who was apparently told by somebody who knew canoes that brand new this canoe would be worth approx 7200$, fully restored would be about 3700$, it will cost anywhere from 1500-2000 to restore so there is some margin for profit if you were to resell it....I'm not sure who this was....or if he actually saw the canoe....but I question the assessment....this canoe appears to be old....and not likely to ever be found as brand new again....if it is indeed old then its value is in its age....but I believe the figures quoted are highly optimistic....even at $3700....and for that it would have to be fully restored....

So I won't make an offer on this canoe....not without further information....and I think even then I could only offer a figure that is certainly far less than the seller may think the canoe is worth....also I understand the seller has had offers (from talking to the restaurant staff)....as much as $900....and quite frankly that is higher than I would be willing to pay....even if the canoe did happen to be something worth while....it just needs too much work....

Thanks to Benson Gray and Dan Miller for their advice....as well as Gil Cramer and Dave Wermuth....if nothing else it has been an interesting exercise....

And maybe finding a canoe for sale in a restaurant isn't all that different....James Raffan found a Henri Vaillancourt bark canoe in an Alberta pawn shop, http://www.canoemuseum.ca/index.php...artbender&option=com_lyftenbloggie&Itemid=126.