Teslin Freighter Canoe fastener questions

[Old Gaffer]

I have just begun restoring a 43 yr old 19' Teslin freighter canoe. The canoe was used for 2 years then the owner died. His family stored the boat in a shed and I was fortunate enough to be the one who removed it for the first time last fall.
As I begin the dismantling job I am finding that under the outwale and along the stem, ferrous nails and staples were used. Is it important to remove all these? I want to use the canoe in salt water so my concern is having the rust bleed thru. My intent is to refasten everything with bronze and copper.
I was considering coating the nails with a thin epoxy as removing them is really tearing up the dry planking.
Any advice would be appreciated!
Once I figure out how to do it, I will post some pictures...

 

[Rod Tait (Orca Boats)]

I always try to remove as mush of the ferrous metals as I can before putting new canvas on and replace with bronze or brass. Rust is not your friend.

 

[Old Gaffer]

The old canvas was stapled on and ,especially on the stem, they have rusted enough that the majority of the staple is staying. Is an epoxy coating a viable alternative to try and encapsulate them?

 

[Old Gaffer]

https://www.flickr.com/photos/95836688@N07/albums/72157675606790204
Perhaps this will work for some pictures with what I am doing with my time...

 

[peter osberg]

I have been using a canoe with the iron staples at the edge of the fabric in the saltchuck since 1980. The staples looked rusty and in need of remediation when I replaced the outwales in the mid 80s (as well as replacing the stems and keel) but decided the damage I was causing getting the staples out wasn't worth the benefit. The rusting staples have not been a problem since I put new outwales on top (and can no longer see them) 30 years ago. Brass doesn't do as well with the salt as copper, so I would avoid the metal alloys.

 

[Old Gaffer]

Thanks for your reply. As I ended up having to replace the top of the stem and also decided to replace the cedar inwales with ash, I was able to rid myself of the majority of the steel fasteners. New planks almost complete of yellow cedar. As I will be using the boat in the salt chuck I feel better with new fasteners. My progress can be seen here...https://www.flickr.com/photos/95836688@N07/albums/72157675606790204

 

[peter osberg]

I have built a few freighters that I have used on the coast over the last 30 years and the yellow cedar stands up really well. Brass fastenings develope some halos, but you have to look closely to be troubled by them, copper fastening have a little greenish staining if you really look for inperfections (there are lots of more obvious imperfect distractions) so it is rarely noticed. Although some people fret about the saltchuck, I will not live long enough for it to be a factor.

 

[Old Gaffer]

I am refastening with copper tacks and bronze ring nails but will use stainless bolts as they are inexpensive and available. Today should see an end to the planking so then I'll have to wade through all the options for hull treatments and canvas fillers...!

 

[peter osberg]

I am refastening with copper tacks and bronze ring nails but will use stainless bolts as they are inexpensive and available. Today should see an end to the planking so then I'll have to wade through all the options for hull treatments and canvas fillers...!

I used the same fastenings, so I must be agreeing that you made the best choices. I came to using lock nuts whenever I have a bolt to use, and bumped up the bolt sizing a bit due to the apparent softness of stainless steel compared to iron or galvanized steel. One comes to believe in whatever is 'one's last choice', in coverings; I posted my routine on this forum a number of years ago, it has served me well.

 

[Old Gaffer]

I see, from looking at past posts, that your fabric of choice is dacron. That was a consideration on mine until I was told that any hull blemish would be painfully obvious. And I wanted to bring the boat back, as close as I could, to the way it was 43 years ago.
My plan is to take the canoe back to Teslin (Yukon) to show it to the old fellow who build it and also to the lady I got it from whose husband was the original( and only) owner.

 

[peter osberg]

I see, from looking at past posts, that your fabric of choice is dacron. That was a consideration on mine until I was told that any hull blemish would be painfully obvious. And I wanted to bring the boat back, as close as I could, to the way it was 43 years ago.
My plan is to take the canoe back to Teslin (Yukon) to show it to the old fellow who build it and also to the lady I got it from whose husband was the original( and only) owner.

It is true that with a thiner fabric blemishes are more apparent. but it is really a question of fabric and filler thickness (and weight wet /dry). Canvas comes in heavier and thicker, absorbs and wicks moisture and relies on the filler to give a nice finish. Commercially built canoes seemed to rely on canvas to hide the blemishes of volume production (although a dacron base fabric was sometimes used by some manufacturers since the 1950's). As a one off restoration a little time sanding and faring, tightening up some cinched nails etc allows you the option of having a lighter, more rot resistant, and more durable canoe. I added extra layers where needed them (on the bottom and where I habitually grounded). Probably more to the point, you examine your own work more critically than something bought off the self. The dacron is easier to use/apply and fill, without the cure times the canvas fillers require, but unless you try a few different fabric types/coverings, it is a leap of faith. For me the lighter end result (by using dacron) in my big freighters is crucial to their usefulness.

 

[Old Gaffer]

I am really interested in what you're describing and wish I had been able to see a Dacron covered canoe earlier in my process. As it is, my #8 120" wide canvas arrived yesterday from Northwoods ( at great expense as I am paying in Canadian $$) so for this project canvas it is. I have a old Chesnut that is next on my list so I'll be inquiring more into Dacron in a bit.
Thank you for your help!

 

[peter osberg]

I am really interested in what you're describing and wish I had been able to see a Dacron covered canoe earlier in my process. As it is, my #8 120" wide canvas arrived yesterday from Northwoods ( at great expense as I am paying in Canadian $$) so for this project canvas it is. I have a old Chesnut that is next on my list so I'll be inquiring more into Dacron in a bit.
Thank you for your help!

I have 8 wood/fabric canoes over on Thetis Island (and some additional small floating craft), with 5 different fabric/filler and paint routines represented, if you are interested to see them, send a personal message and we can try and set something up. Your locator said Vancouver Island so you may be nearby!