Peterborough Shorty
- Thread starter Andy
- Start date
Paul Miller
Canoe Nut
Hi,
Dan's canoe guide list the model 86 as first built in 1929 and continued until late 30/s early 40's.
The decks were most likely butternut and I have only seen White Oak as gunnels on that era Petes.
You definitely need to redo those decks.
Good luck,
Paul
Dan's canoe guide list the model 86 as first built in 1929 and continued until late 30/s early 40's.
The decks were most likely butternut and I have only seen White Oak as gunnels on that era Petes.
You definitely need to redo those decks.
Good luck,
Paul
Thanks. I have looked at Dan's site and he also lists a 1914 start date for model number 86. Mine is a ceded strip and not canvas so do you think it could be the earlier model. I have removed the front deck today and it is full of rot and worm. I could do with pictures of early Peterborough decks. Can anyone help. Andy
David McDaniel
Canoe Dude
Andy, The fact that your canoe has a brass tag instead of stamped in the stem, dates it as pre 1929. Hopefully Dick or Dan will chime in here soon to
confirm this!
......Dave
confirm this!
......Dave
Paul Miller
Canoe Nut
Paul Miller
Canoe Nut
After a closer look at your decks, I don't think they are butternut, but more likely Chestnut based on the grain pattern. Butternut doesn't show that much grain. But then again you don't see much of those decks.
Paul
Paul
Dick Persson
Canoe builder & restorer
Hi folks,
The model #86 was introduced 1912 and was available in rib & batten, flush batten, longitudinal strip, cedar rib, and canvas covered. The cedar-strip model was available until 1925. Decks were normally made from butternut and outwales should be white oak.
Dick Persson
Buckhorn Canoe Company
Buckhorn, Ontario
www.buckhorncanoes.com
The model #86 was introduced 1912 and was available in rib & batten, flush batten, longitudinal strip, cedar rib, and canvas covered. The cedar-strip model was available until 1925. Decks were normally made from butternut and outwales should be white oak.
Dick Persson
Buckhorn Canoe Company
Buckhorn, Ontario
www.buckhorncanoes.com
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Wow. Some really useful information. I did not think the decks were butternut. I have stripped one side and the wood looks original but is very light so probably not chestnut, any ideas. I have noticed that both stems have been replaced with laminated ply!! I assume the original would white oak like the gunnalls. I am in the UK, any idea where I could get butternut. Thanks to everyone for the advice and looking forward to the next installment. Andy
Kathryn Klos
squirrel whisperer
Thought I'd post pictures of a couple of items made of chestnut. The color and grain-pattern is similar to the wood species on your decks-- the darker wood, beneath the top-pieces.
The first picture is of the little table I use as my computer desk and the other is of a paddle.
If the canoe contains any American chestnut, this may help date it.
Kathy
The first picture is of the little table I use as my computer desk and the other is of a paddle.
If the canoe contains any American chestnut, this may help date it.
Kathy
Attachments
Good Luck! It doesn't even grow on trees in America anymore!
David McDaniel
Canoe Dude
Here is a pic of a Peterborough model 44 with chestnut decks!
David McDaniel
Canoe Dude
Andy, Have you removed the two side strips covering the decks? I'm thinking the original deck my be under them. It looks to me that
someone has replaced the king plank and added the two side strips!
.....Dave
someone has replaced the king plank and added the two side strips!
.....Dave
Kathryn Klos
squirrel whisperer
Wow, that could be a toughie, as it can be hard to find in the US! At the end of the 1800s and early 1900s it was still being used in houses for door and window trim here, and this is how it sometimes comes into the hands of canoe restorers-- at salvage yards or if you know a house with chestnut trim that is being torn down.
You may have to settle for using ash...
Kathy
You may have to settle for using ash...
Kathy
Sassafras is the closest grain pattern to chestnut should you be unable to locate any chestnut. In New England, it is the restoration wood of choice for carpenters making home repairs in historic homes with chestnut trim where they cannot secure old growth chestnut. If we were to place my sassafras paddles next to Kathy's old chestnut paddle ( pic in an earlier response) , one would be hard pressed to tell the difference, the grain pattern is sooo similiar. I have also been using sassafras for replacement canoe decks and boat transoms. I have to haul sassafras logs from NJ to saw on my sawmill as it does not grow large enough in diameter in New Hampshire, rarely larger than 4-6". Hope it is available in the UK .
Dick Persson
Canoe builder & restorer
Andy,
I went back to my Peterborough files and took a closer look at what woods they listed for decks at various times. It seems that the cedarstrip canoes were listed with butternut decks all through to the early 1920's when chestnut also was listed as deck material. Please post a picture of the metal thwart tags as this may make it easier to narrow down the dating.
Dick Persson
Buckhorn Canoe Company
Buckhorn, Ontario
www.buckhorncanoes.com
I went back to my Peterborough files and took a closer look at what woods they listed for decks at various times. It seems that the cedarstrip canoes were listed with butternut decks all through to the early 1920's when chestnut also was listed as deck material. Please post a picture of the metal thwart tags as this may make it easier to narrow down the dating.
Dick Persson
Buckhorn Canoe Company
Buckhorn, Ontario
www.buckhorncanoes.com
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What a lot of information
I will try and give you more to investigate. I have removed the bow decks and they are rotten and were refitted with filler pieces of wood around the outside edge this is why the extra strips were fitted to hide the mess underneath. The stern deck is in better condition but is well rotted,but at least I have a good template to use to replace.
I show a picture of the tag so Dick can try and research some more info and pictures of removed decks.
The next question to all is seating. The thwart looks original and I think the seat mounting is original but there is no seat. so what would it have looked like. I also show pictures of laminated plywood stems. I presume these were white oak in the original.
Thanks again to all
Andy
I will try and give you more to investigate. I have removed the bow decks and they are rotten and were refitted with filler pieces of wood around the outside edge this is why the extra strips were fitted to hide the mess underneath. The stern deck is in better condition but is well rotted,but at least I have a good template to use to replace.
I show a picture of the tag so Dick can try and research some more info and pictures of removed decks.
The next question to all is seating. The thwart looks original and I think the seat mounting is original but there is no seat. so what would it have looked like. I also show pictures of laminated plywood stems. I presume these were white oak in the original.
Thanks again to all
Andy
Dick Persson
Canoe builder & restorer
Andy,
I am looking for a picture of one of the thwart tags. Your canoe should have four of them, two on each side. See attached picture.
Cheers
Dick Persson
Buckhorn Canoe Company
Buckhorn, Ontario
www.buckhorncanoes.com
I am looking for a picture of one of the thwart tags. Your canoe should have four of them, two on each side. See attached picture.
Cheers
Dick Persson
Buckhorn Canoe Company
Buckhorn, Ontario
www.buckhorncanoes.com
Attachments
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davelanthier
Wooden Canoes are in the Blood
Andy,
Here's a few photos of the circa 1912 16' Peterborough I restored this year. The stern seat was a factory option in mine. It was a hand caned seat with the same mounting as yours. I could email you a large photo file of this canoe if it would help. This one never had thwart tags. Maybe Dick can explain.
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Dick I have checked and there are no thwart tags and I cannot see any evidence of fitting.
Dave I would appreciate some pictures of the restored canoe can you mail them to a.noblett@tiscali.co.uk
Shopping list so far
American White oak have found supply locally
White Cedar to replace some strip edges around the decks (cannot find only red available in UK I need about 4ft of strip)
Wood for decks cannot find sassafras, butternut what about Elm or Sycamore I need enough for both decks.
Andy
Dave I would appreciate some pictures of the restored canoe can you mail them to a.noblett@tiscali.co.uk
Shopping list so far
American White oak have found supply locally
White Cedar to replace some strip edges around the decks (cannot find only red available in UK I need about 4ft of strip)
Wood for decks cannot find sassafras, butternut what about Elm or Sycamore I need enough for both decks.
Andy
