Another one I have not seen before

Discussion in 'Research and History' started by Canoeal, Jan 22, 2018.

  1. Canoeal

    Canoeal Canoe/kayak builder/resto

    Picture0118181429_1.jpg Picture0120181539_1.jpg Picture0120181543_1.jpg Picture0120181544_1.jpg Picture0120181548_1.jpg
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 24, 2018
  2. Paul Miller

    Paul Miller Canoe Nut

    Very nice Canoe and very rare canoe

    I'll bet built by a guide boat builder and the plank is feather lapped.

    The ribs are really cut "frames" not ribs.

    Peter and I restored a similar built short version. IMAG0351.jpg IMAG0351.jpg
     
  3. OP
    OP
    Canoeal

    Canoeal Canoe/kayak builder/resto

    That is not one of my pictures and I see no indication the ribs are "cut" in my pictures as 'cut' ribs tend to be broken easily and there is not any visible breaks.. the cross section of yours is squared and deeper than the rounded ones in my pictures. You also seem to ignore the full length mini inwale, that is not typical of a guideboat...
     

    Attached Files:

  4. Paul Miller

    Paul Miller Canoe Nut

    I apologize for providing my opinion, I won't let it happen again.
     
  5. OP
    OP
    Canoeal

    Canoeal Canoe/kayak builder/resto

    I am just making the observation that mine is not like your ribs I do know the bottom board is guideboatish, but the cross section is rounded, not vee'd at all like I would expect in a guideboat. The center seat is also guideboat-ish. I am still trying to narrow the boat down to a maker, an area, something for my customer other than "it is a nice old boat. " I still appreciate the comments. Just want to refine the facts as we can. I will be getting a chance to see it, and take better picture later in the spring...I have built a couple of Guideboats and the decks and crossections just haven't matched any I have seen...
     
  6. MGC

    MGC Paddlephile

    It would be helpful to know where the boat is located and any known provenance.. often boats of this type don't travel too far from where they were built .
     
  7. Michael Grace

    Michael Grace Lifetime Member

    Hi Al,

    I agree with you and Paul that this canoe clearly has guideboat-like features, but appears to me that your ribs are half-round and steam-bent. There are a number of guideboat-style canoes around, some of which you've seen at Assembly and perhaps elsewhere. We have one that has a combination of features that lies in between the canoes you and Paul showed. Photos are attached here, exactly as the canoe was found - we have made no modifications and haven't restored it yet. Note that this one is lapstrake, not smooth-lap. We have no idea of the maker. Boats and Boating in the Adirondacks illustrates and describes several guideboat-style canoes in its appendix. One made by the guideboat builder Lewis Grant has a thin inwale and appears to have half-round ribs. Ours is 13' 5" long, and it has steam-bent ribs of rectangular cross section, a wide bottom board, guideboat-style bang plate and shoes, and guideboat-style seat cleats. Unlike the canoe you're asking about but like the one shown by Pauls, ours has no inwales. I'm sure I'm not adding anything you guys don't already know, but these are fascinating canoes and hopefully this information adds value and helps generate even more interesting discussion.

    Michael
    Grace_guideboat-canoe.jpg Grace_guideboat_style_canoe_2.jpg Grace_guideboat_style_canoe_details.jpg
     
  8. OP
    OP
    Canoeal

    Canoeal Canoe/kayak builder/resto

    The boat was purchased at a auction with no given provenance. It is located on the Delaware in Bucks county PA. None of that was any real help to me, as I do not believe it to be an indigenous boat. I am aware of the similarities to a guideboat and agree it may have been built by a guideboat builder. I cannot get to my copy of Halley's book as it is buried away and I am in a boot with a broken foot, awaiting my wife to get it out for me. I have also seen a boat like Michael Grace's canoe (one owned by a Chapter member) that is attributed to Racine canoe company , but both of those seem to be smaller and narrower than this appears to be... Keep the discussion coming though, perhaps we can figure it out. It mat turn out to be some form of a Guideboat yet, But I haven't ever seen a guideboat with such narrow planks...
    I have put a offer to look at it to the owner (She's been out on the West Coast) but I don't yet have a date to see it. She does want it restored, so maybe...
     
  9. Dan Miller

    Dan Miller cranky canoeist Staff Member

    I was thinking Racine when I saw Michael's photo, too.

    Do you have dimensions, Al? Can you determine if the yoke and seat stringer are original to the canoe or later additions? In several ways, it looks like it could be of St. Lawrence River origin.
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  10. OP
    OP
    Canoeal

    Canoeal Canoe/kayak builder/resto

    DSCN0203.JPG Picture0120181542_1.jpg Picture0120181540_1.jpg No I have no exact dimensions and have not yet physically seen the boat. So far all I have is pictures and a rough dimension of about 13'. Not much to go on, I know. Let me see if I can post some other pictures. I think I posted the 'best' of them. The stems are rather odd for a guideboat built canoe. That, and the very flat nature of the floor is not guideboat-ish. It almost appears to be an all- wood built version of a wood canvas canoe shape.
     
    Last edited: Jan 24, 2018
  11. OP
    OP
    Canoeal

    Canoeal Canoe/kayak builder/resto

    Yeah that one looks a lot like Ken Wallo's racine.
     
  12. OP
    OP
    Canoeal

    Canoeal Canoe/kayak builder/resto

    Still haven't had a chance to see it, as I am still in a boot and crutches...
     

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